From a Satsang during Serbian retreat with Mohanji in May 2014
Q: How did the souls become?
The first possibility for creation was relativity- when the big bang happened. When the supreme energy split into many so that there is a possibility of me and you, otherwise it’s One, original unity.
A: We make a machine, like a washing machine or a refrigerator. We put various ingredients into a particular mode so that we can wash objects or cool them. Then electricity executes it. Electricity can remain electricity without expressions, or electricity can go through machines and express its presence, like light, air-conditioning, washing machine, refrigerator. So electricity’s presence is felt through objects. These are the bodies with life. Just as petrol can exist as petrol or can manifest as movement. So creations have happened and creations started creating. That means, the first possibility for creation was relativity- when the big bang happened. When the supreme energy split into many so that there is a possibility of me and you, otherwise it’s One, original unity. Why is duality created? Because creativity was only possible that way. There have been many, many creators because once the clay was available…
Take the whole consciousness as an ocean. If you pour the whole ocean onto anything, it will destroy the whole thing. But if it is minute quantity, it can nourish something. If the whole electricity comes into this building, the building will burn. You need transformers and further transformers to reduce its intensity so that the lights can burn. This is what happened in the whole creation when relativity was formed.
The universe formed only after the big bang. When relativity occurred after the big bang, the energy split in trillions of pieces across the universe. Otherwise it was just one consciousness existing as this was billions of years ago. When the bang happened, One became Many. It was all over the space. Space was created. Space was created with relativity. Relativity was created with space. It’s all intermixed, it’s all connected. This is connectivity between supreme consciousness that we call Father and trillions of children.
See, if you are the only person existing in this world, you will never know who you are. Because there is nothing to compare with. Duality gives you opportunities, helps you to realise dimensions. So duality was created. For the duality to be created there should be ‘this’ and ‘that’. They are the same as Father. Father did only one creation – just explode himself. Then all his children scattered across the universe because universe was created by Father, by just exploding himself. Then all the children across the universe got the opportunity as creators, they can experience creation. But who is actually experiencing the creation? The witness is the Father. Father is witnessing the children creating further. Like our family. Each generation creates the next generation. Like that creation became the creator, and creators started creating more creations. This is the flow.
We are creating in two dimensions each day. We are creating our destiny through our thoughts, words, action, emotion. It means we are creating our further lives at this point in time or while we are living. This is number one.
Number two, we are creating successors, or our next generation, propagating our species through procreation. Though you do not know how to infuse a soul into a body. We can only kill an animal and release the soul. We do not know how to bring it back. This is the level of consciousness that we are operating in. But you can create only something with available material. If material is not available here, you can’t create a particular thing the way you like. Your creativity depends on the material available, right? The kind of colours required for the artist to paint, if the paints or the colours are not available, he will have to use what is available. Likewise, in our creativity also, our consciousness matters, which level we are operating in. Only that we can create. We cannot create in different dimension with our available consciousness or awareness.
What Father did was, he exploded himself, and made available the material for creation, which means through relativity. Once exploded, space was created. You need minimum space and time duration for creation. So, time was created. Then, third is awareness that a unit is as powerful or as potent as the macrocosm. Microcosm is equal to macrocosm, the only difference is in the form, dimension. The opportunity was given. You have the space, you have the time, now you create. So, various beings started creating various forms.
There are two levels of creation happening in the earth plane. One is the evolutionary creation. It means one form becomes another form. This is actually internal creation or evolution, like, an ape became a man. Second is that entities are coming, attaining a form and living here. This is birth by choice. An avatar happens or something comes into mother’s womb, and attains a human body. This is also possible. So the creation at will plus evolutionary creation.
Human beings started trying to understand what makes all this possible. That is why the ancient man worshipped the sun, whose energy is very important for earth. Then the wind, the water, the air, the earth. So in vedic times people were connecting to the beings of nature and the elements of nature. From there they realised that there are energies which have the power to create, induce a soul into a body, and create bodies. These are the creators. We started calling them gods. The principle of inducing a soul into a body, is the same principle as the prana pradishta used in temples- inducing energy into the idol. They make an idol, induce the energy in a particular way, so that it becomes a deity. The same way, as the body is created, the soul is induced.
But don’t think that somebody comes and induces the soul in the womb everytime. It’s not so. Because then it becomes karmic cycle. The soul decides to go into any womb which suits its purpose. So theoretically it’s the same as putting a soul into the body for creating an entity, similarly through the way of certain chants and rituals you bring an energy and put it in the idol so it becomes powerful. One more aspect is that there is a particular level of power you can induce into any idol. But there are sometimes saints who leave the body and put the soul inside the idol or a place. That has much more power. These places become the power centers. Because they are giving their own soul into the idol so that it can stay forever. Body is perishable. These are the places like Shirdi Sai Baba’s place, where his body is kept. Thousands and thousands of people are coming and everybody is getting results and benefits. The most powerful places of worship in India are all associated with some saints. They have left their body and induced the soul into that place. So the soul attracts people and induces blessings.
But in order to induce a soul into any material, the person who can do it should have mastered the soul. Otherwise you can’t just leave the soul anywhere. It will just wander. You need to have an absolute control on the whole activity of the body, having merged with the soul. It takes the range of a very powerful master, siddha or avadhoota to do this. Otherwise various saints die, but nothing happens.
Q: Do they come back exclusively into human bodies? Do they often come back into the families where they had been?
A: If a person has extreme desire for meat, he can become a tiger in the next life. That is the clearest desire. Consumption of meat is like an obsession. When a person becomes a tiger, for fifteen years he can eat only meat, then he’ll come back. Have you heard the word ‘yoga prashta’? It means expelled or displaced from yoga. A person who has been practising yoga for a long time, and suddenly started having extreme sexual urges. He falls. There is no falling actually, he diverts. Then he may take a body of an animal or probably human as well, just for the gratification. Then he comes back again. So yoga prashta is more or less going in the path, deviating and coming back again. Maybe it will take another lifetime. You can see this in certain sects which practise celibacy. They can’t hold it. They can’t move on. So what happens is they are spiritually growing at the same time they are suppressing sexuality. Then it comes back with a bang. Then they topple. We can see this in various types of yogis. That is why I always say, fulfilment is important. Move on, avoid suppression! Move on with fulfilment, so that your practice also grows and at the same time you are evolving. This is very important.
It’s a collaboration. A set of souls decide, ”We will come back to earth and enjoy relationship.” It need not be family members. It could be your boss, or a priest of your church, any kind of relationship you have, guru and a disciple, father and mother, father and child, any permutation or combination. These are all souls deciding to come together, and experience the earthly life in unity. Once a soul decides, I’ve had enough of you,” ha, ha, they go and take birth elsewhere… there is full freedom. Normally the souls do not choose other dimensions. If you have not seen any dimension beyond earth, you will not choose to go there because you do not know. So once you evolve and you start expanding and experiencing other dimensions, then you have multiple options. Otherwise you keep coming back to earth. That is why evolution of awareness is extremely important.
Q: What do you think about transcendental meditation?
A: Every path is good. I have good opinions of every path, because it suits somebody. It may not suit everybody, but it suits somebody. If you can transcend into any frequency in the transcendental path, it is always elevating. But it is especially good if you have no objective or if you have one objective which is total nullification.
Usually what happens is every path has some faith. ”If you do this, you get this result.” That hooks the mind. If you follow anything related to transcendental aspects of life without conditions, without expectation, it can elevate you. Because then you are not entertaining the mind. You are keeping the mind quiet but you are doing your thing. So mind is not really occupied with activity. The more mind gets occupied, the more binding happens.
All paths are good. I actually feel that there are numerous gurus, paths, religions, all are good because each helps somebody. We should look at everything objectively. Like, there is a buffet on the table. You want to eat everything, but you can only consume as per the capacity of your stomach and as per your inclination for food. Likewise, you choose what suits you. Like the dress you wear. You wear it because you chose it, you like to wear that dress. Everybody has their choices. Seven billion people means there are seven billion aspects of existence. All are unique. There are no two buffalos alike.
I only say, first, don’t believe any guru who says ”I’m the only one”. Second, if anybody tries to bind you to himself or to some activity, run away. Third, the moment you start to be miracle oriented, understand you are vulnerable. Because you are only looking at miracles, you are not looking at evolution. This is again the play of the mind. Remember these three things.
Sometimes, when we are at the party or at a buffet dinner, we taste some things. It doesn’t mean that it’s the only thing we eat. Likewise, you can taste certain methods. There’s no harm in it. But the moment it starts binding you and you feel without it there is no existence, it is just an addiction. I feel that you should be meditating if you love to meditate, not that you have to meditate. There is a big difference in here. Whatever you love to do, evolves you. Whatever you have to do, binds you.
One of the primary things in the spiritual path is you should use your feeling more than your eyes. Everything that glitters is not gold. However, if you use your eyes or ears to look or feel a guru, you might be disillusioned. You might not understand the truth. But feel the guru or feel the energy. Try to feel more than see. Then the chances for delusion are much less. This is very, very important to understand. That is why often a guru who has passed on is more respected than one who is alive. But actually, as I said earlier, if you have found one person who is connected to the source, even if you lose your life don’t leave because that is enough; you found the rocket to reach the moon. But there will be tests before you get close to the guru. There will be tests on your conviction, determination, clarity that this is what you want to do. Otherwise, half-way through, you will say, ok, this is not what I want to do. And then you take a detour. Many times in spirituality this happens. People travel a little bit, and then say, this is not what I wanted and deviate. Then they start feeling completely angry and disillusioned about the whole spiritual path. These are all traps of this system. But be clear about it. That is why I said last time, run away from people who bind you at any cost. Those who keep you liberated, definitely, go with them.
Fundamentally, there should be unconditionality, not conditional interaction; whether you are here or there, whether you are happy or sad. Lastly we have a concept, a picture in mind. For example, Shirdi Sai Baba, with a turban and all the attires of that time. If we are looking for a guru of that level, we will find one. But that may not be Shirdi Sai Baba. And then when you get closer, you may be dissillusioned. This happens many times to spiritual people. You need to accept the guru that comes to you. It may not be the same picture that you have in mind. Suppose, you have a picture of Babaji in mind, and you find somebody who resembles him, and then you immediately connect to him. Then, what happens? That person is definitely not Babaji. So mental concepts should never be a barrier on a spiritual journey.
You have the right to accept what is right for you, reject what is not right for you. If you accept whatever gives you inner silence or liberation, it’s extremely good. That is exactly what you are supposed to do. And if you accept anything that binds you and say, this is the meditation, this is the path, a daily ritual; there is no heart in it, it’s a burden. That is to be avoided. Then, if you are only looking for inner silence and this is benchmark you are keeping for yourself, and you are evolving, then whatever comes which suits that journey, this is ok. Then nobody can cheat you. Because your purpose is very clear. If you move around without clarity, and you try to have mental images, ”Oh, my guru should look like this” , like Shirdi Sai Baba, or Babaji, or Sathya Sai Baba. So many people go to someone who looks like a past master and get trapped. Why I am saying this is because concepts are often traps in our existence. Then to get out is very difficult. You start blaming the guru, the situation, other places. But the problem is that your concepts are binding you and making you miserable.
In early years, there was a person who had the power to materialise, so I was looking at him as Sai Baba. Even now he is very active. There is a meditation that this man is propagating, there is my voice and my script. But it took many months for me to realise that he was using me. And he was trying to put me under his umbrella so that he could get… But what distracted me were a couple of incidents which were not very interesting for me. And people were coming, he collected money from some people who were coming to see me. I did not even know. Not small money. Substantial money. One day one of these people called me and they thought I was getting a share from it. See how manipulation works? We don’t know because we connect and think, this is Sai Baba, because he can materialise something, but any magician can do the same. But it took time. This is what I’m saying.
We might be deluded for a long time, because we are bhakti, devotion, we connect to some other entity. And this was actually a princess of Malaysia who sent me a message. Mohanji you are much purer than this kind of thing going on, get away from that place otherwise you will be tarnished. She went to see him and she was very sharp, she could recognise him deep through. I was more blinded at that time. In front of me she said, ”Mohanji I’m staying in a resort which costs a lot of money. It would be better if I get a place to hire and build my own to stay here when I come here… I said, ”Princess, this is a good idea.” Once you are not there, other people can stay. She agreed. I suggested this to this guru, and immediately an architect came and said 13,000 USD. Princess said, ok, go ahead. While she was there, this guru said, ”No, it is 26 000 USD.” By the time she reached Malaysia, they doubled the price again. Princess called and said,”Mohanji do they think I’m an idiot?” When I went to Malaysia, we went to the palace, had dinner and then she was explaining how the manipulation was going on. And it was her who warned me so she told me, ”Get out of the place, you do not fit there.”
In another instance, one disciple of this guru goes to an astrologer very often. That guy is not an astrologer for money. He is a school teacher. But he practises this. So the astrologer asked the person who was staying with this guru, ”How is this guru doing?” He said, ”He is doing well.” A lot of people are coming, there are a lot of activities. Then he asked, ”How is Mohanji doing?” He said, ”He is also fine. One day he will be more famous than this guru.” Then this guy came and told this to that guru. This is where the problem started. Real manipulation started then. Because some people started coming to me. I did not know why these people were coming to me. I am also serving just like anybody else. Later on I understood this was the game. And the princess said she was going to talk to the prime minister of India, she was very detrimental. And I also detached. The whole point I am saying is these kind of things are very much there. It all looks cosy, everything is fine, but we never know. Maybe we are used. No regrets, this was education. I’ve never told anybody that I’m their guru. If people ask me, ”Are you my guru?” I always say, “This is your realisation, not my saying. If you feel, it’s ok. If you don’t feel, it’s ok. There should be no binding. We should flow freely, so I’m free, you’re free.’’ I keep this because if I do not have purity, I cannot deliver purity.
One of my followers met this person because somebody contacted recently from japan and said, ”I heard your voice, but I heard different meditation which is not on your website.” I said, ”This is another one which I gifted to them,” ha, ha. So princess asked me to sue him and take it back. That time I gave it from my heart so I said, ”Let him keep it, no problem.” And I’m not bound by any of this anyway. So this man met him recently and he was doing a discourse. He knows that I was connected to him many years ago. He created ash and gave him. This guy also knows magic. He created ash and gave him also. He became very angry.
Q: How do I reconcile my spiritual journey and what I do at work when there are conflicts, there is lack of integrity, bad morality, etc. Sometimes it causes conflict inside me.
A: I think you already had the answer. I’ll explain. Every human being plays multiple roles each day. At home he is the king. At work place he is an employee. With his children he is the father. With wife he is the husband, with parents, he is the child. There is no segregation, you are floating through it. Each has a different flavour. This is what we call life. Out of these roles, which is the real you? The one who is watching the whole show is real you. So you are going through each situation and you are acting from one role to another, but you still remain immune to everything. You are acting each role, but once you remove the make-up, you are a different individual. That is the real you. So the answer is, play each role well. What did Krishna tell Arjuna? ”Arjuna, your role is to fight. You are a warrior. You chose the birth of a warrior. Fight and win, that’s your job.” In the war there could be murders, he showed him the Visharupa, the full form, in which all the people Arjuna was supposed to fight and kill are already dead and gone, in real time. So Krishna said, ”You are just an instrument. You are not doing any great job.”
Do you know when you have stress? When you do something which you have to do, not which you love to do. Otherwise there’s no stress. How many more things do you do which you have to do or are compelled to do, versus how much of your waking state you are doing what you love to do. This is the criterion with your success and failure in life. Now you decide, if you have to do this job. If you lose this job, you have a problem. Do this job as long as you have to do it, because you cannot afford lack of income state. But nurture what you love to do on the side. Let it grow, side by side. One day, you can switch over. How do you know what you love to do? It gives no stress, it gives fulfilment, and you will be happy to do it. Or you don’t need any artificial stimuli or provocation to do it. You are self-inspired for it. This is good for you. This is what is close to your basic nature. Nurture this. Make it grow to the level where one day you can smoothly switch over from what you have to do to what you love to do. Once you switch over, then that is where your life begins. Until then you are existing. For example, one lady is not well, she needs crutches until her leg becomes stronger. So the job which you have to do for your money are the crutches to take you until your leg becomes stronger. Once you are on your feet, you don’t need the crutches.
Q: During meditation I felt tickling at the top of the head, what was that?
A: When you go into higher vibration, automatically kundalini gets activated. This is not the final kundalini activation which we talked about for complete transit. We can call it many names but I don’t want to confuse you with names. So the bubbles will be felt at the top of the head. This is all inside. When you shift to certain frequencies you can possibly connect to frequencies or energies outside. That you may feel as external movement or some kind of activity, this is the second level. Like there is a school teacher for first class, second class, third… there are various frequencies in which masters operate. When you attain a certain frequency, there is a possibility of energy transfer. Or it may not even be energy transfer, it may just be supporting you to be in that plane. When you connect to my eyes and meditate, you are connected to me, then my energy comes to you or is transferred to you, or you will feel my presence as well. This is the fourth level. Fifth is some insect comes on the top of your head and you have different sensation, ha ha…
Q: How do we know where the line that we shouldn’t cross when we are trying to help somebody, e.g. in a story a woman thought she had the right to steal somebody else’s child. How do we know how far we can go?
A: This is more or less the mother’s emotion. Because she could not stand a small child being beaten by the father, she snatched the child and ran away. You can’t look at the morality of it. It’s the mother’s heart. The social morality has no value. But mother’s heart was pure. Her interest was to save the child. That’s pure, this has to be appreciated. In the absolute sense, she did the absolute sense. In the eyes of law this is wrong, but in the eyes of humanity, this is right. The purpose and purity makes the difference here. Sometimes people snatch a child and use it for begging. It is absolutely wrong. If you kill or rape a person, that’s a different thing. But here, it was to save and she sacrificed her life for the sake of the child. She was only 16, chose not to marry and worked as a tailor. She left the city, lest people there should catch her. Well this story is from a movie. Nevertheless, if the purpose is pure and clear, it is justified.
Q: How can we be sure that it is not something wrong? Did that woman have the right to interfere in the karma of that child?
A: I always say, stay with the truth: the one truth that you are totally free, liberated being at this point in time. What binds you is the mind, ego and intellect factor. Stay with the truth that you are a liberated being even now. You don’t need any other certificate for that. Then do what is right according to this truth. Then you will be free.
Transcribed by Biljana Vozarevic
Edited by Aviral Srivastava